Subwoofer setup and MultEQ

Many powered subwoofers have controls that are set manually.  It's important to follow some simple guidelines to avoid having these controls interfere with proper subwoofer calibration and integration with the satellite speakers.

  1. If the subwoofer provides a direct input (sometimes called LFE input) then it should always be used.  That input bypasses the filters in the subwoofer and allows the bass management system in the AV Receiver to operate properly
  2. If there is no direct input, then the lowpass filter knob on the subwoofer should be permanently set to the highest frequency it allows.  That way it will not interfere with the MultEQ measurements and bass management
  3. The level control on the subwoofer is often set too high.  This can cause the AV Receiver to run out of level correction range when MultEQ tries to set the subwoofer to reference level.  Set the subwoofer level control to the midpoint.  If MultEQ reports high negative trims (e.g., –12 dB) for the subwoofer, then you should turn the level control further down and run MultEQ again
  4. If there is a Phase control on the sub it should be set to 0°

If you have a subwoofer with room EQ, then you should run that first in the subwoofer and then run MultEQ in the AVR

If you have an external subwoofer processor (such as the SVS AS-EQ1 or the Audyssey Sub Equalizer) you should run the calibration in that processor first and then run MultEQ in your AVR

If you have two subwoofers, there are some additional steps to take:
  1. Place them at equal distances from the main listening position
  2. Set the level controls on the back so they both play at the same level
  3. Connect a y-cord to the sub out of the AVR and then connect to both subs
  4. Turn off processing in the subs as it will not be able to give you the same resolution that you will get from MultEQ (thousands of points vs. a few parametric bands)
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399 Comments

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  • 0
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    Audyssey Labs

    The Polarity warning is just a warning to check the wiring.  If it's correct then you can hit skip and proceed.  There is no effect on the distance calculation or the filter calculation.  

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    Frederic Thise

    Hi Chris,

    I did the battery test you suggested.

    On the main speakers (FR & FL), it worked perfectly well and i was able to determine that the polarity was right. On the other end, the same test (but with a 9V batery) on the subwoofer did not produce anything useful.

    To perform the last test, the battery was plugged to a small item with 2 wires (i don't know the correct name, it's some king of tester), each one ended by a small crocodile clip. I connected the clip of the red wire to the pin of the RCA connector and touched the circular part of the RCA plug with the other clip (ending the black wire): all it produced was a pop each time i made the test... It was impossible to determine the movement of the woofer. I also tried to reverse the wire but the result was the same.

    I tried the test on both the SVS sub and the JBL sub with the same result. I must have done something wrong, i tried to find additional information/explanation on the web but without success. Do you have an idea?

    Fred

     

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    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Fred,

    I'm afraid I am out of ideas. Is there an audible issue or are you just curious why there are differences compared to your previous setup?

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    Frederic Thise

    Hi Chris,

    I have indeed some Bass issue i am trying to address (i fear this issue is more a mechanical than an acoustical one: i am trying to limit excessive vibrations in the sofa which are driving me crazy). Being sure that i have correct polarity on all my speakers/subwoofers is probably a good idea ;)

    As said in one of my earlier post, the reason i think i have polarity issue is that when i tried a 4 subs configuration using the as-eq1, i could see in the before graph a huge and wide dip (which was not there with a 2 subs configuration either with the JBLs or the SVSs). Once i flipped the phase switch (polarity switch hopefully), the dip was completely gone in the graph. It means that either the JBLs or the SVSs have the wrong polarity... At the moment, the only thing i am sure is that my FR and FL speakers have the correct polarity.

     

    Fred

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    Audyssey Labs

    The vibrations are most likely coming from mechanical coupling.  So, usually, the best way to reduce is to isolate the sub from the floor with some sort of stiff rubber feet.  I seriously doubt this has anything to do with polarity.  

    It's not surprising that the 4 subs had a smoother response.  That's one of the key reasons to add more subs: driving the room modes from multiple points smooths out the response.

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    Frederic Thise

    Hi Chris,

    yes i know that: i never thought that my polarity problem (if i really have one) had anything to do with my vibration problem. All i meant was that, before trying to resolve the latter, it would be best to be sure that the polarity is right otherwise i may encounter acoustical artifacts that will give me a harder time solving my main problem...

    I already tried a lot of things during the last year to solve this vibration thing like using what you suggested and a lot of other stuff (positioning, different materials under the subs, ...). I have a dedicated small, closed and rectangular room (5,40 by 3,80 meters) and i think that the direct coupling subs/floor is not the problem. I think it is mecanical but that maybe the subs are producing sound waves (forgive this terminology) that make the floor vibrate/resonate and these vibrations are transmitted by direct coupling to the sofa or the sofa is resonating at some frequency that are particularly annoying to me... It may also be that my 2 SVS PB12plus are too big for my room (i never had this problem with the 2 JBL 150P).

     

    Well, i know taht all of this has nothing to do with Audyssey but i happen a few month ago to do a calibration (with the AV8003 and as-eq1) that did suppress all unwanted vibrations to the cost of a less bassy experience. It was not a flawed calibration as i followed the guide to the letter but probably the mike positioning was different. Since then, i tried other calibrations (with different polarity settings) but was unable to reproduced it.

     

    Anyway, thx for your help. I know the road will belong before being able to fully enjoy my system ;)

     

    Fred

  • 0
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    Mark Fruehm

    Hi Chris,

    I have read through the blogs, and have tried the suggestions.  My Audyssey set-up is still not completing.  I have a Onkyo 606, Axiom fronts and center, and a SVS 10 inch sub.  The sub only has gain and phase settings, therefore I know it can't be a setting issue on the sub with respect to a low-pass filter.  I have put the phase to 0 as suggested.  When the audyssey set-up runs, it cycles through all speakers, and then when it comes to the sub, it always comes up with speaker error.  I have my crossovers set at 80 (for all speakers, including sub).    Does the sub possibly have to be set to "constant on" vs. coming on when it senses a signal?  Even that shoudn't be the issue, as I was using it to play music prior to running Audyssey, so  it should have been on.  Any ideas as to what's causing the error?

  • 0
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    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Mark,

    The sleep/standby mode in subs is often the problem.  The first couple of Audyssey chirps may be getting corrupted as it wakes up.  I would try turning that off and then running Audyssey again.  After the calibration you can set it back on auto-sleep mode.

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    Andrew Woodley

    Hi Chris, I'm sure this has been asked loads of times but I'm getting a little confused, I have a Onkyo 5008 with XT32, I'm about to purchase another SVS PB13 ultra and run 2.

     

    What is the best way to set these up, with a Y connection & run these together or as 2 separate sub's & allow XT32 to set them up on a individual basis. thanks

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    Audyssey Labs

    The Onkyo 5008 has the Sub EQ HT feature.  You should connect each sub to the AVR separately.  They will be first pinged individually and then together as "one" to create the room correction filter. 

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    Miles Weber

    Hello,

    I have a OnkyoTX-SR806 with MultEX. Is it true my version on MultEX will not allow for room correcting filters for my subwoofer? I was told some versions might only provide crossover points and distance for subwoofer channel. I would love to take advantageof  the software and get ride of any Hz spikes caused by my room if possible.

    Thanks - Miles

  • 0
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    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Miles,

    MultEQ does correct the subwoofer with high resolution filters.  You can check at the bottom of this page for the functionality of the different versions of Audyssey room correction:

    http://www.audyssey.com/audio-technology/multeq

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    Pragere

    Hi Chris, I have a problem with calibrating my Onkyo TX-NR809 - this is failing with a Speaker Detect Error on the subwoofer. I have a Klipsch RW-12D, with the top sub pre-out of the Receiver connected to the Left Line In input of the subwoofer. 

    Here are the sub's settings:

    Power - 'Always On'

    EQ Mode - Flat

    Lowpass - 120 Hz

    Phase - 0 

    Please help, thanks!

     

     

  • 0
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    Audyssey Labs

    Strange... Where is the sub volume control set?  Are you hearing the Audyssey test signal playing from the sub?

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    Pragere

    Thanks for your quick response. The sub volume is at it's max level, at +11Db. I am hearing the test signal from the sub. 

  • 0
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    Audyssey Labs

    That is most likely the problem.  The sub signal is overloading the mic measurements and clipping the mic.  Turn it down to below the mid-point and run Audyssey again.

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    Pragere

    Thanks Chris, will try this.

    I was just following the MultEQ XT calibration instructions in the NR809 manual, where it says in Step 4 "Adjust the subwoofer volume level to 75 dB, and then press ENTER. If you set the subwoofer’s volume control to its maximum and the level displayed is lower than 75 dB, leave the subwoofer’s volume control at its maximum and press ENTER to proceed to the next step.". 

  • 0
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    Pragere

    Chris, this worked, thanks!

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    Craig H. Lintner

    I have a similar sub to Chris - a Klipsch RSW-10d (a little smaller but self-powered).  I just got my speakers last week and Onkyo TX-NR709 last night and started setting everything and tried running Audyssey and had the same problems with it not detecting the sub.  I'm thinking that it may have been too loud like you suggested above.  However, I noticed that Chris said his was set at "Lowpass - 120 Hz".  The Klipsch has the option to bypass or something like that and I thought that I had read that we were supposed to set it to that?

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    Craig H. Lintner

    Sorry, after re-reading, I meant to say a similar sub as Pragere's!

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    Audyssey Labs

    Craig, I'm pretty sure that the sub is turned up so loud that the measurements are corrupted.

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    Aneek Mollah

    Hi Chris,

    This is a GREAT Q&A forum! I've learnt lots!... I just have a question about my subwofer setting. I have a Denon AVR 4311, and Difinitive Technology speakers. On my sub I have set my Low Frequency Crossover to 150Hz (& set to bypass), my Phase is set to zero, my gain is 1/3, BUT which setting should I set my Variable High Pass crossover to? the range is 40Hz to 150Hz. Thanking you in advance!

  • 0
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    Audyssey Labs

    Hi Aneek,

    I believe the high pass filter is only applied if you are using speaker level connections.  I hope you are not doing that!  The subs should be connected to the AVR via line level so they can be treated as actual subs.

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    Aneek Mollah

    WOW! ...Thanks for a fast reply!..... & thanks for clearing that up! ... You are correct!.. I'm not connecting the sub using speaker level connections, I've connected using the LEFT & RIGHT LFE input, and used a two into one adapter to connect it to the AMP. Is that the correct way to connect it? or should I just connect one? that is only the left... or only the right? Thanks once again Chris for your time! it's greatly appreciated!

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    Audyssey Labs

    That's the correct way.  Use a y-cord from the AVR to feed both subs.

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    Aneek Mollah

    Sorry Chris.... I only have ONE sub, but on the back I have a LEFT LFE INPUT & a RIGHT LFE INPUT, on the same sub, and I've used a Y-cord to connect BOTH left and right LFE input on the sub to a single output on the AMP. I assume that is correct?

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    Audyssey Labs

    Got it.  That way is fine, but no real advantage over using a single sub input.

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    Aneek Mollah

    THANK YOU! one last question while I've got you... It's not Audyssey related... BUT I was thinking of getting a second Sub,... Do BOTH the subs have to be same power? can one be smaller than the other? and where should they be located? THANK YOU once again!

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    Audyssey Labs

    It's a good idea to add a second sub because it will drive the room modes from a different location and this results in smoother bass.  However, it does need to be at least the same size (driver diameter) as the first one.  If it's smaller it won't really help much.  It's difficult to predict where the subs should be located without measurements in your room.  In general, the front two corners are good.  Alternatively, one in the middle of the front wall and the other in the middle of the back wall.

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    Greg Giddens

     

    I have a REL R305 and an M&K V125 sub connected to my Denon AVR 5805MK2 with 7 speakers, FL, C, FR, SR, SBR, SBL, SL. I currently have the subs set up as R & L. I chose the configuration in the manual that refers to a 7.2 front R & L setup. I have addressed this before here and with Denon and Denon said that the 5805MK2 does send separate signals to each sub so they did not recommend using a Y cord and using the single sub out on the receiver for multiple subs.

    I have just finished my room including treatments. I am trying again to use the auto setup in the 5805 and I am getting less than satisfactory results with Audyssey. I have tried it both with a Y cord and without. My current question is the LFE volume knob on the REL, what should this level be set at? All of the documentation I see tells me to set the Sub's volume to 1/2 and the crossover to max freq. I have done this but like I said my REL has an extra setting for LFE level.

    The second thing is this great question I can't seem to answer which is to "Y" cord or not to "Y" cord my two subs. When I run the setup in my 7.2 config I do get 2 separate distances from the subs to the microphone like Denon tech support said it does. Can you please comment on this? Also I have chosen to use the connector REL supplies to connect from the sub to the front main L and R speakers. According to REL Tech support this sends the main L & R signals to the sub's processor for additional EQ'ing with the speakers signal. Why would I want to not use this feature? To me not using it is like not using all the whistles and bells that come with the best units... This is why I am trying to configure all of these items with the Denon and get them to work with the built in Audyssey MultiEQ xt, I would like to use all of the features of my equipment.

    Thank you

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